What you think about people selling fansubs for profit?

fantasydream3 · Post by **fantasydream3** » Apr 11th, '05, 21:00

I'm so angry at those people selling fansubs

. They make profit off the hard work and time people are spending to fansub. These people are actually fans that are doing this freely and it's by fans for fans! NOT by fans for sale!!!!

nyichiban · Post by **nyichiban** » Apr 11th, '05, 21:58

Funniest thing today. I went to my local Chinatown in Manhattan and right next to a police precinct is a small mall. They have a shop that sells anime on VHS. These anime are fansubbed animes that has been recorded onto VHS! And how funny is it that the damn shopping center is right next to a police precinct and nothing is done about it? I find this very interesting. Forget ebay, this guy has an actual storefront and he plays the episodes in his store window. Anyone in the nyc area can go visit and see for yourself. That is absolutely despicable.

pankanshe · Post by **pankanshe** » Apr 11th, '05, 22:28

Selling other's work is absurd.

DarReNz · Post by **DarReNz** » Apr 11th, '05, 22:39

nyichiban wrote:Funniest thing today. I went to my local Chinatown in Manhattan and right next to a police precinct is a small mall. They have a shop that sells anime on VHS. These anime are fansubbed animes that has been recorded onto VHS! And how funny is it that the damn shopping center is right next to a police precinct and nothing is done about it? I find this very interesting. Forget ebay, this guy has an actual storefront and he plays the episodes in his store window. Anyone in the nyc area can go visit and see for yourself. That is absolutely despicable.

lol are you gonna report him then ?

kargeo · Post by **kargeo** » Apr 11th, '05, 22:51

Very intersting, so they did really sell it in the store, I wonder if they have cover/box ;)

I think it's ok if they are not trying too expensive, since it's actually free.
However, not everyone have the access or time to download it or making into anytime of media.

I saw that ebay # 6385949375 too, wow, she released it fast. I would pay it that cheap, but there are always stupid people bid it high... definitely won't buy # 6385961769.

I wonder why they don't stated where they got from, at lease buyers have the choice if they are willing to do it themselves.

nyichiban · Post by **nyichiban** » Apr 12th, '05, 04:40

I did report the guy to the cops and they said that there is a specific division that deals with that kind of stuff and that they are kind f busy. Since the guy is a small fry in their books i'm pretty sure they will leave him be. Yes he does sell it in his store and there are no covers just labels on the VHS which seem like a pretty lousy job (glue and photocopied titles).

Saburo · Post by **Saburo** » Apr 12th, '05, 05:11

Interesting thread here.

I think it's pretty sleezy but if you think you can stop people from paying for whatever they wanna buy... well, fuhget it.

Post by **neonkinpatsu** » Apr 12th, '05, 05:14

nyichiban wrote:Funniest thing today. I went to my local Chinatown in Manhattan and right next to a police precinct is a small mall. They have a shop that sells anime on VHS. These anime are fansubbed animes that has been recorded onto VHS! And how funny is it that the damn shopping center is right next to a police precinct and nothing is done about it? I find this very interesting. Forget ebay, this guy has an actual storefront and he plays the episodes in his store window. Anyone in the nyc area can go visit and see for yourself. That is absolutely despicable.

There was and probably still is a place in Philly like that too. I believe it sells comics and stuff, the store front looked legit but like a mom and pop store. Inside it was full of anime fansubs on VHS. I have no idea what happened to it or anything. I worked with a guy who raved about the place back in 2000. Back then they sold VHS copies for like $5 a tape

aoi_hana · Post by **aoi_hana** » Apr 13th, '05, 05:08

I think it's funny that he's still got listings on ebay... after over a year since people have been reporting it.

I reported it again, just for fun

azn_wrx · Post by **azn_wrx** » Apr 14th, '05, 23:00

heres another seller

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... 48810&rd=1

im pretty sure these are good fakes

okumasama · Post by **okumasama** » Apr 14th, '05, 23:21

azn_wrx wrote:heres another seller

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... 48810&rd=1

im pretty sure these are good fakes

These are not exactly fakes. They are the "Chinese versions", or some call them Chinese bootlegs. Nothing less than the originals-exact copies of the original DVDs (quality and printing), just Chinese subtitles included. I am not sure if the printing companies do or do not have the rights but the sure thing is that's a good source for people not willing to spend the extrordinary 20,000YEN to buy the Japanese version.
Personally I think they are not completely illegal or legal. What I mean is they might be legal to some areas and illegal to some other due to different copyright laws in each area.
Mind that the subtitles included are different than the ones offered by the Chinese subbers over the net. In addition in might take no more than 2-3 weeks after the end of the broadcast of a drama for these to be out. That means there are some professionals out there, working for these companies. The RMVB files you usually see in d-addicts are actually rips from those DVDs. The Chinese price is about 4$ for each DVD box. That's normal for China. Of course the ones you see in eBay contain extra profits and shipping charges from China.
In any case the people that print those have the responsibility, not the buyers. They do know better than everybody in here what they are doing and what's happening (illegal or not).
Don't get me wrong, I don't suggest you buying those or support the idea. Selling fansubs though it's much different than those DVD Boxes. I don't think anybody here would be that angry if somebody just copied the Japanese DVDs and sell them in eBay. It would be his problem and it would have to do with the companies not with this community. The fact of selling fansubs though it's a much much different issue.

azn_wrx · Post by **azn_wrx** » Apr 15th, '05, 20:48

okumasama wrote:
azn_wrx wrote:heres another seller

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... 48810&rd=1

im pretty sure these are good fakes
These are not exactly fakes. They are the "Chinese versions", or some call them Chinese bootlegs. Nothing less than the originals-exact copies of the original DVDs (quality and printing), just Chinese subtitles included. I am not sure if the printing companies do or do not have the rights but the sure thing is that's a good source for people not willing to spend the extrordinary 20,000YEN to buy the Japanese version.
Personally I think they are not completely illegal or legal. What I mean is they might be legal to some areas and illegal to some other due to different copyright laws in each area.
Mind that the subtitles included are different than the ones offered by the Chinese subbers over the net. In addition in might take no more than 2-3 weeks after the end of the broadcast of a drama for these to be out. That means there are some professionals out there, working for these companies. The RMVB files you usually see in d-addicts are actually rips from those DVDs. The Chinese price is about 4$ for each DVD box. That's normal for China. Of course the ones you see in eBay contain extra profits and shipping charges from China.
In any case the people that print those have the responsibility, not the buyers. They do know better than everybody in here what they are doing and what's happening (illegal or not).
Don't get me wrong, I don't suggest you buying those or support the idea. Selling fansubs though it's much different than those DVD Boxes. I don't think anybody here would be that angry if somebody just copied the Japanese DVDs and sell them in eBay. It would be his problem and it would have to do with the companies not with this community. The fact of selling fansubs though it's a much much different issue.

ah I had a hunch they were copies, they are still bootlegs. What makes me even more mad is that he has reference to jdorama in his auctions. Glad to see you back okumasama.

uniquo · Post by **uniquo** » May 7th, '05, 14:45

geee... I was suspicous about won_bing 5 and coconut2003. And you guys proved me right. Its soo hard to find genuine stuff on ebay now..If the stuff out there is fan subbed I might as well d/l from here. By the way the screenshots from here http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... eName=WDVW look great!!! was this a tv rip or dvd rip? I can't tell soo clear.

okumasama · Post by **okumasama** » May 7th, '05, 17:53

uniquo wrote:geee... I was suspicous about won_bing 5 and coconut2003. And you guys proved me right. Its soo hard to find genuine stuff on ebay now..If the stuff out there is fan subbed I might as well d/l from here. By the way the screenshots from here http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... eName=WDVW look great!!! was this a tv rip or dvd rip? I can't tell soo clear.

It's obvious that the abode auction is about homemade burns. The "If you have any questions, please email me. Do not assume and bid. If you bid, you are fully responsible for payment" thing makes it clear. Then the seller doesn't say anything about "sealed" or "original". Many sellers will say this for bootlegs too; but at least they would be silver-factory made; not homeburns. Also that seller doesn't provide any picture from the DVD-box or the DVDs. That's a clear point. He doesn't say any number of DVDs so I can't tell you if it's DVD-copy or TV-rip. Don't trust the picture's you see. Usually if you have a clear idea of what has been funsubbed and what not you should be able to identify fansab sellers in no time because... they would only sell the ones that are fansubbed.

awrittensin · Post by **awrittensin** » Oct 19th, '05, 20:28

I couldn't find another thread like this, but mods, feel free to merge this if I overlooked another one.

I came across someone who is running a "distro" anime and drama service, however, she is charging $6 per DVD. That means she's obviously profitting big time. Not Gingertoys2 magnitude, but she's still making money from OUR hard work. The drama I recently finished, ame to yume no ato ni is one of the dramas she is selling, and I noticed that she is offering a lot of dramas that I believe were subbed by members of the d-addicts community.

As a fansubber, I know the hard work and effort that goes into subbing, so I wanted to alert my fellow fansubbers here that their work might be being sold for profit. I emailed this person and requested that my drama be pulled from her website, and I believe if other fansubbers do the same they might be able to get theirs pulled as well.

I told her an example of an appropriate distro service is like the one Buruburu from jdorama runs - he charges 75 cents per DVD, which means he is clearly not profitting from it.

Here is the website. Fansubbers, protect your work!
http://www.animedivxonline.com/digisub2.html

moviezman · Post by **moviezman** » Oct 19th, '05, 21:00

It is scandalous that such thing exists.
Fansubbing is a non profit action done and dedicated by/ to fans as the name suggests.

WroW · Post by **WroW** » Oct 19th, '05, 21:04

If you look through the dramas ,than you will realize that all subs he has come from d-addicts because, if you take Resurrection for example...subs from 1-15 have been released and he sells 1-15 ...and that goes on for almost any drama

gryzze · Post by **gryzze** » Oct 19th, '05, 21:20

WroW wrote:If you look through the dramas ,than you will realize that all subs he has come from d-addicts because, if you take Resurrection for example...subs from 1-15 have been released and he sells 1-15 ...and that goes on for almost any drama

I was thinking the same thing. Seems that she's taken just about every softsubbed drama from d-addicts, fansubs by Jtv and captures done by JEM.

awrittensin: Has she answered your email yet? (I can still see your subs on her list)

I doubt that she will remove anything just because we ask her to.

sadotsu · Post by **sadotsu** » Oct 19th, '05, 21:26

That is... a horrific tihng to do. I can't even find the words to describe how disgusting that is. We should bring this to the attention of the admins and mods.

chckboy5 · Post by **chckboy5** » Oct 19th, '05, 21:40

ive seen gingertoys on ebay, does he jsut convert the soft subs found here to dvd?

blushyy · Post by **blushyy** » Oct 19th, '05, 21:49

I, uhh... want to kill this person! Arghz!

Spike23 · Post by **Spike23** » Oct 19th, '05, 21:52

Yea i read many threads before about this issue.
Its clearly a disrespect, i wanna smack this person in the head for doing this.

Everyone spends the time and effort for us all to enjoy at no cost and some **** decides to make profit without concerns of other people they stole from.

Its an insult to the community.

Post by **mizune** » Oct 19th, '05, 23:41

Moving to General Discussions because Kdramas are involved as well.
There used to be a thread or two around here about this issue, but I haven't been able to find it yet. Unfortunately, this is nothing new. There will always be jerks out there willing to profit from the works of others (and there are even some who will even believe they are justified and defend themselves and their actions), but that's the way the human beings are and that's the way the world is....In the long run, none of what we do here is technically on the bright and legal side of things anyhow, so...

But this is the greatest drawback of softsubs and why established groups will spend the time to hardsub their works. Educating the buyers that they are being ripped off and informing them of where they can find the actual sources of "free for the fans, by the fans" stuff is the most effective countermeasure for this sort of thing. If you put it in a softsub, it is easier than dirt to edit out whatever you want (or even edit in stuff you want). Hardsubbed videos can be edited as well, but it takes more work and effort to do so; hopefully, that extra bit of work will deter the average seller. In any case, if they're determined, they'll find a way around it...
Meh....

Anywho....

BuriGuri · Post by **BuriGuri** » Oct 20th, '05, 00:19

Out of curiousity, has anyone ever bought hard-subbed dramas that these people are selling? I've always wondered how the eBay-ers still have 99%+ feedback ratings when a lot of dramas have intrusive messages about "not for sale," "get this for free," etc... Can they even edit that stuff out? I would imagine doing so would disrupt the video enough that buyers would know something is wrong...

aNToK · Post by **aNToK** » Oct 20th, '05, 00:32

Gee, only 4 or 5 dramas I've worked on up there. Should I feel insulted yet? I can guarantee that these files are coming from here.

Hello, Mister or Miss Animedivxonline, so when are we subbers going to see some of the profit from your damn $6 dvd's eh? Distro service my ass. How the f*** do you sleep at night, you ignorant thief???

Hey, did you remember to get the fixed subs for Lawyers 1? Hate to see you putting out a less than perfect product with my name on it. And don't forget that we've got a whole slew of new ones coming out for you to profit from. Do you mistakenly think that there aren't ways to backtrack and find out where the hell your little "distro service" is? Maybe you can look for a special little shout-out in some of the next shows coming down the pipe....

You might want to be real careful when you're sending out those stolen shows. Never know who or where the people you're pissing off are. Or what resources they may have to see about getting you shut down.

aNToK · Post by **aNToK** » Oct 20th, '05, 00:42

By the way, if any members here would like to tell this individual how much they appreciate those who rape fansubbers work for profit, here's the e-mail address.

Go ahead, show your support!!! coolatta@rochester.rr.com

Wonder if this person knows that the state of New York can prosecute individuals who SELL pirated copies of shows. Little bit of a different game when money's involved...

rico2001 · Post by **rico2001** » Oct 20th, '05, 00:43

This is really terrible.

It makes me so mad to see ppl selling what fansubber work very hard on. It is truly a shame.

And I agree, this is the one negative of soft subs.

octavius · Post by **octavius** » Oct 20th, '05, 01:18

come on guys, all that downloading is tough tough work.. why shouldnt this person profit when they spent days upon days of strenuous downloading...

if i were in NY, i'd drive there and whoop their ass.

awrittensin · Post by **awrittensin** » Oct 20th, '05, 01:49

The person hasn't emailed me back yet, to answer that question. I just emailed them today, so if they reply at all (which I doubt) there's still time.

What I think is hilarious is who the hell is buying these dramas from her paying $6 per DVD?? I mean, that is a lot of money for one DVD. She doesn't have to sell that many until she's breaking $50 or $100. Even if I didn't know I could download it for free, I'm pretty sure I would think $6 per DVD is a shady price.

yt_toshi · Post by **yt_toshi** » Oct 20th, '05, 01:59

awrittensin wrote:What I think is hilarious is who the hell is buying these dramas from her paying $6 per DVD?? I mean, that is a lot of money for one DVD. She doesn't have to sell that many until she's breaking $50 or $100. Even if I didn't know I could download it for free, I'm pretty sure I would think $6 per DVD is a shady price.

Just look at sellers like gingertoys2 and the one that you just emailed and you'll see that there are dumb people who are willing to buy what she's offering.

To these sellers, I feel like

amrayu · Post by **amrayu** » Oct 20th, '05, 02:06

I go through these stages... bitter and angry about the fact that fansubs are being sold. Then my total fansubbing morale takes a dip and that's when I take a break from fansubbing and want to quit. Eventually, I get back into the mood and start fansubbing again.

What keeps me going... fans, the drama community and it's also a hobby of mine.
Ways to prevent the selling of fansubs:
Stop fansubbing.
Continue fansubbing but release to a limited number of close friends.
Release super LOW QUALITY files.

Maybe we should just babelfish all the translations from now on too. ^_^

babytsubasa · Post by **babytsubasa** » Oct 20th, '05, 02:08

What kind of moron buys fansubbed stuff anyways.

If I had the money, I'd probably buy the real thing. YOUR WORK HERE IS APPRECIATED EVERYONEEEEEEEE!!! thanks for all the fansubbing!!!

Kinzaru · Post by **Kinzaru** » Oct 20th, '05, 02:43

Thanks for the heads up, awrittensin.

Jin91 · Post by **Jin91** » Oct 20th, '05, 02:57

babytsubasa wrote:What kind of moron buys fansubbed stuff anyways. If I had the money, I'd probably buy the real thing. YOUR WORK HERE IS APPRECIATED EVERYONEEEEEEEE!!! thanks for all the fansubbing!!!

yes~ your work is very much appreciated! I cant believe some one would sell a fansubbed dvd. they should buy the real thing to support the drama

leinaday · Post by **leinaday** » Oct 20th, '05, 03:21

this is TOTALLY unethical!

1. In the first place, such j and k drama are meant to be shared freely and subbers are kind enough to sub word for word (in my opinion, that's really hard work for them too!) and then release to others to download.

2. If such sales continue, this would really disrupt the free distribution of drama and such. Unless everyone wants to profit from selling drama and finally pay for subbed drama, then we shall let her continue.

mangosteen · Post by **mangosteen** » Oct 20th, '05, 03:31

This doesn't surprise me at all because we can't prevent these thieves from selling our work. Let's think of something we can do to prevent this.

tianj · Post by **tianj** » Oct 20th, '05, 03:40

Why don't everyone find the most spamming-type mailing lists and it'll flood their emails with a bunch of crap. That be a disincentive at least.

crazylife123 · Post by **crazylife123** » Oct 20th, '05, 03:47

The only thing we could do is use hardsub instead of softsub. Then marked the episodes with D-Addict Fansubber.

----Not For Sale----

----Not For Rent----

----Especially NOT EBAY---

---Free on www.D-Addicts.com---

Put that on every episodes, people will get everything here soon enough.

garnet07 · Post by **garnet07** » Oct 20th, '05, 03:58

Selling Fansubs is just WRONG. Why won't people just get the link to D-addicts and download it themselves, instead of buying it off people for what $6 bucks. That's so much. At least I mention the REAL fansubbers who do the work for all these dramas in my website. Sheezz, people need to know more about this site I swear. Ok sorry for the ramblings, but this is so frustrating (even if I haven't done any fansubs of my own).

aNToK · Post by **aNToK** » Oct 20th, '05, 04:17

If anyone ever wonders why I usually push for hardsubs in the dramas I'm involved in, here's a prime example...

GTOnizuka · Post by **GTOnizuka** » Oct 20th, '05, 04:18

This is just wrong. I really appreciate what you fansubbers do. Especially when you take time out of your life to do this for people like me who cannot translate, but wish I could to help. Now if I found out my hard work was being sold Id be ticked. Is it possible maybe to add in the backrround in transparent wording where to get the show from? Maybe in the middle of the show? I dont know what else to do except violent things. Like punching em in the eye.

Eria · Post by **Eria** » Oct 20th, '05, 04:35

this really makes me sick!!!!

i mean, if i like a drama sooo bad, i'd go to yesasia and get an original one. but this sh*t is just f*cked up!!!

i just wanna bomb this place. someone should buy one just so we can get their address, go there and beat the sh*t out of them.

i understand that sometimes, it takes forever to dl the torrent files or from clubboxes, but the fansubbers are also going out of their way (in their daily normal lives) to bring us good quality sh*t. if they sacrifice, we fans also have to sacrifice.

i think we should bring it to the law. someone in new york should call the local office and see what they can do about this. this is major stealing because the fansubbers are not profiting. THIS IS NON-PROFIT!!! if they can do something about the entertainment industry (which is for profit), then i'm pretty sure they can do something about this.

i just wanna kill those f*cks!!!

groink · Post by **groink** » Oct 20th, '05, 04:42

Woah! Is it that time of the year, where we talk about gingertoys2? Nah, I'm going to pass this time.

--- groink

dochira · Post by **dochira** » Oct 20th, '05, 04:48

groink wrote:Woah! Is it that time of the year, where we talk about gingertoys2? Nah, I'm going to pass this time.

Have you said all that needs to be said about gingertoys, groink?

Post by **lilswtangel** » Oct 20th, '05, 05:02

eerrrrghhh!!
He/she is really out to make money and definitely not sharing his/her collection as a good soul:
1. $6 for a dvd and $1.75 for a cd..........

pleaseeeeeeeeeeeeeeee, as if~
2. notice how this person gives links (jdorama for jdramas, and soompi for kdramas) out to find out the drama info.....but she/he doesn't give out the link to D-A so that they could download for FREE~ considering that's a loss in profits if the customers turned to D-A

i'm sure gingertoys2 and this anime/drama divx fansub distribution person are reading this thread again.

oh, was gingertoys2 ever banned? if i remember correctly, Ruro found who she (?) was from her email address. no?

________________________

Xi@h · Post by **Xi@h** » Oct 20th, '05, 05:22

I'm not a fansubber, but such attitude irritates me much and I feel that the d-addicts staff should trace him/her out and ban his/her ip forever. Man what a disrespect towards the community.

I like softsub most because I can move the subtitles a bit up because it stick too low down the tv screen but if it goes like this, better you all guys do hardsub.

nyaan · Post by **nyaan** » Oct 20th, '05, 05:26

I found this on ebay...
http://cgi.ebay.com.au/Devil-Beside-You ... dZViewItem
It's obviously downloaded from d-addicts.

I'm a bit baffled why people would buy that since there is an original copy dvd selling for US$23.99
http://cgi.ebay.com.au/DEVIL-BESIDE-YOU ... dZViewItem

Maybe it's the english sub but I don't think it justifies this person selling something that he or she got for free...

Xi@h · Post by **Xi@h** » Oct 20th, '05, 05:31

There's something that get into my mind, why we find these m*********ers range of ip addresses he/she used and ban it on this board and publish it publicly for all seeders and upcoming seeders to ban from their BT client?? I don't know if it's feasible or it will be pain in the *ss!!

groink · Post by **groink** » Oct 20th, '05, 06:06

dochira wrote:Have you said all that needs to be said about gingertoys, groink?

If you Google for "gingertoys2", my article on that swine is up there in the top-10. Here it is for your convenience:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

HOW DOES GINGERTOYS2 DO IT?

gingertoys2 is the number-one seller of fanworks and other copyright infringing products. Her "Power Seller" status is clearly a sign that she's also making a lot of money. It's quite easy for her to sell fanworks on eBay and get away with it. How does she do it? I should be selling these tips! Anyway, here are the five basic steps to her success, with the help of eBay and the availability of fanworks:

- Leave out ALL information that could be incriminating or that goes against eBay's Safe Harbor policies. In other words, it's basically a "no-tell" policy. As eBay sees it, gingertoys2 doesn't incriminate herself, and eBay will allow her to continue her sales, as long as she's making money for eBay. Also, it helps to make her eBay ads very vague. If the buyer doesn't get what he expected, that's his dumb fault for not asking her the right questions. For example, gingertoys2 leaves out the fact that her DVDs are actually DVD writables, and that they're TV captures. eBay does not allow the sale of DVD writables containing ANY type of content, nor do they allow the sale of captures off of TV or any other source for that matter. So, she doesn't mention her merchandise as being bootlegs, eBay doesn't bother researching claims by buyers, and therefore both she and eBay are off to making the money.

- She sells products produced by companies who are not members of eBay Safe Harbor. If she sold something made by Microsoft or Adobe, they'd have her bids closed in no time! gingertoys2 is much smarter than that... She instead avoids any products that are owned by a member of eBay's Safe Harbor. Even if TBS or NHK files a complaint with eBay, eBay won't do anything because the companies cannot prove they actually own the rights to the material being sold. Ignorance is bliss. Becoming a member of SH is a requirement for filing any type of a complaint claiming copyright-related issues.

- Negative feedback does not affect gingertoys2. eBay does not consider the comments made in negative feedback as evidence of her breaking eBay Safe Harbor policies. In other words, they treat the complaints as a "he said, she said" matter, and for the two parties to work it out amongst themselves. Even worse, buyers are now afraid to give her negative feedback. So far, she's responded to all negative feedback with negative feedbacks of her own - nearly 100-percent of time.

- Play stupid. gingertoys2 doesn't even claim ignorance. She believes what she's doing is legal. She truly believes that, as long as something isn't being sold in the United States with English subtitles on it, it's perfectly fine to sell them. In other words, copyright infringement isn't happening since the product isn't licensed in the U.S. This is her comeback message in most of her negative feedbacks to pissed-off buyers. Hey, it works to her advantage!

- Other miscellaneous tips: Over-charge your shipping rates. It's impossible to prove fraud of this nature because the seller can, under eBay's rules, claim "handling fees", and combine them with the actual shipping fees. In gingertoys2's case, she charges US $3.00 or more for shipping. She doesn't even use the word "handling". Several buyers claim they received their DVDs with the postage showing as 60-cents. She therefore makes at least $2.00 in ADDITION to the money she charges for the DVDs. Seeing she sells dozens of DVD sets EACH DAY, that $2.00 per item adds up! You go, girl!!!!!

In summary, leave out the detailed incriminating information, sell products not marketed in the U.S., fight back on all negative feedbacks given to you, and just play stupid on all legal and moral issues presented to you. If you follow these tips like gingertoys2 does, you're on your way to making thousands of dollars on eBay, using material provided to you on the Internet absolutely free! A number of P2P people will hate your guts, but what the hell... It's not like they live next door to you, right?

--- groink

dochira · Post by **dochira** » Oct 20th, '05, 06:13

groink wrote: If you Google for "gingertoys2", my article on that swine is up there in the top-10. Here it is for your convenience:

I did Google "gingertoys2", interesting reads...and yet, it continues to happen.

crossvii · Post by **crossvii** » Oct 20th, '05, 07:05

$18 with $10 shipped?! Oh em gee. It's surprising how many of those buyers state they've been looking for english subs for awhile now, but never stumble onto DA; just by doing a simple search on yahoo for Devil Beside You+eng subs and anyone would find it. I guess some buyers are just as ignorant as the sellers.

Anyways, I think it'll require more than just marking eps with hardsubs. Scenes could easily be cut out with all the movie editor programs that are available. Maybe marking the eps using the scroll text to disrupt every now and then would be better.

~Adam~ · Post by **~Adam~** » Oct 20th, '05, 07:15

Well what she is doing is wrong, pure and simple. I appreciate what all the fansubbers do out there, and thisis taking advantage of all the fansubbers hard work.

floss · Post by **floss** » Oct 20th, '05, 07:43

Damn. If we have more people like her, she's going to screw it for all of us.

Eria · Post by **Eria** » Oct 20th, '05, 07:47

i emailed someone from new york in charge of non-profit organizations. i asked if they can help us or direct us to someone who can help shut that guy down. i will let you know what they say!

chckboy5 · Post by **chckboy5** » Oct 20th, '05, 07:50

but i guess she has to go through the effort of converting them so you can watch them on a dvd player lol

gryzze · Post by **gryzze** » Oct 20th, '05, 08:09

chckboy5 wrote:but i guess she has to go through the effort of converting them so you can watch them on a dvd player lol

Actually she didn't. To quote her page: "All titles listed below are either in Divx or MPEG format. Playable on computers only."

sadotsu · Post by **sadotsu** » Oct 20th, '05, 08:51

Umm... I hope I don't stir anything up by asking this, but... what happened to gingertoys in the end?

chckboy5 · Post by **chckboy5** » Oct 20th, '05, 09:33

gryzze wrote:
chckboy5 wrote:but i guess she has to go through the effort of converting them so you can watch them on a dvd player lol
Actually she didn't. To quote her page: "All titles listed below are either in Divx or MPEG format. Playable on computers only."

im talking about gingertoys2... but she selling it for like 15 bucks per drama. I guess ppl would dish that amount if they dont have fast internet and if they wanna play it on their tv. I know id like to have some of my favorite dramas on dvd to watch on a big tv or so...

gryzze · Post by **gryzze** » Oct 20th, '05, 09:51

chckboy5: Ah... my bad

Her [gingertoys2] ebay profile contains hundreds of comments like "Awesome DVD quality". Some people are obviously stupid.

charmedjean83 · Post by **charmedjean83** » Oct 20th, '05, 12:24

aNToK wrote:If anyone ever wonders why I usually push for hardsubs in the dramas I'm involved in, here's a prime example...

Geez~ I can't believe the cheek of this person! It really p*isses me off to find dramas that we've all worked on up there...lets flood their inbox with msgs! $6 a dvd?!?!!

I guess hardsubbing lawyers didnt really stop them either~ ..........

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Guest Book

For every 25 Guest Book inputs you make, you get 1 DVD of your choice from my site for free.

1) One input per Guest Book,
2) Websites must be Anime Related.
3) Cannot be a anime fan subtitler website. oh??

4) No Porn or Warez Related websites.
5)Here is what you must input in their Guest Book:
Hey! My name is [Your Name], and I was sent here by www.animedivxonline.com to sign your Guest Book! You have a really great website, keep up the good work! (^_^) <-- yeh.. my A*s!!
6)Be sure to keep a log of all the website URLs, I will check each and every one. Submit an e-mail to me with the list of URLs. Please do not mail me any attachments, you must place the links in your e-mail.

Wants us to promote his/her "it's" website huh??

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

athrunjustice · Post by **athrunjustice** » Oct 20th, '05, 12:26

spam/flood their emails

crossvii · Post by **crossvii** » Oct 20th, '05, 15:25

Hm.. I feel tempted to create a phony ebay acc. and just disrupt some "sales"... It'd be interesting to see her negative comments firsthand.

Eria · Post by **Eria** » Oct 20th, '05, 15:58

chckboy5 wrote:
gryzze wrote:
chckboy5 wrote:but i guess she has to go through the effort of converting them so you can watch them on a dvd player lol
Actually she didn't. To quote her page: "All titles listed below are either in Divx or MPEG format. Playable on computers only."
im talking about gingertoys2... but she selling it for like 15 bucks per drama. I guess ppl would dish that amount if they dont have fast internet and if they wanna play it on their tv. I know id like to have some of my favorite dramas on dvd to watch on a big tv or so...

playing it on tv isn't even a big deal anymore. you can get s-video cables for less than $15 bucks and connect your computer to the tv. you get the same quality of video your getting from your computer.

i'm starting to get annoyed to those people who actually buy stuff there. they're feeding off it when they know some people work their arses for it.

i won't be surprise if fansubbing slows down this season.

SHD · Post by **SHD** » Oct 20th, '05, 18:44

OK, couldn't the community get a little more coordinated and groups that have their own sites like jtv and sites like d-addicts, soompi, and jdorama have very obvious banners saying the usual:

Keep Fansubbing Free--Do Not Buy From EBay sellers, etc....

and list or link to a list of sellers (updated, no links). It won't stop sellers but at least stop them from using the sources to help their sales. there's threads like this one all over each site but nothing up front and coordinated.

btw--profit-making is not restricted to EBay, on a Hawai'i Kdrama board there was discussion of a box dvd set of Kim Sam Soon sold by Coolwin (and others) that contained episodes subbed by soompi members.

d0diro · Post by **d0diro** » Oct 20th, '05, 19:11

Just tell the police they sell illegal ****, easy as that. for ebay sellers try and inform the original copyright owners and get them to sue those sellers. No need to mention this here and fansubbing even.

In North America it should be easy to get them down.

As for things like animedivxonline - their whois data is fake and thus you can get the domain to be deleted. I think it's quite much **** that especially american offerands allow inputting crap as whois data. Especially providers like godaddy seem to be professionals with this ****, however it seems they even allow reporting fake or incomplete data in the whois result page.

canon05 · Post by **canon05** » Oct 20th, '05, 19:52

I'm very much against the idea that it's all right to make profit from selling dvds. Fansubbers make the captions for fans. On top of that, they make the captions for free. That's unfair. Stop exploiting fansubbers!

Often the buyers think it's such a hassle to get the series. cannot be helped, there's already FAQ. To add that, some series with English subtitle are difficult to get.

edited: Somebody has suggested this.

mangosteen · Post by **mangosteen** » Oct 20th, '05, 20:12

SHD wrote:OK, couldn't the community get a little more coordinated and groups that have their own sites like jtv and sites like d-addicts, soompi, and jdorama have very obvious banners saying the usual:

Keep Fansubbing Free--Do Not Buy From EBay sellers, etc....

and list or link to a list of sellers (updated, no links). It won't stop sellers but at least stop them from using the sources to help their sales. there's threads like this one all over each site but nothing up front and coordinated.

btw--profit-making is not restricted to EBay, on a Hawai'i Kdrama board there was discussion of a box dvd set of Kim Sam Soon sold by Coolwin (and others) that contained episodes subbed by soompi members.

This sounds like a very good idea!

spacecommand · Post by **spacecommand** » Oct 20th, '05, 20:19

The problem is, people purchasing these dvd's from GINGERTOYS get the material after-the-fact and can't get refunds.

I remember gingertoys was selling Shomuni 3 more than likely stolen from JEMs). I know shomuni 3 has warnings, watermarks etc all in them.

Most people buying from gingertoys have a notion that its the legit english version not a dvd copy, or stolen fansub. Once they find out its not, I'm not sure what they can do about it, you leave a bad feedback, they leave a bad feedback at you, and the folks over at ebay as mentioned Don't give a rats a** about what they do.

amrayu · Post by **amrayu** » Oct 20th, '05, 20:59

Like SHD has mentioned, all we can do is constantly tell fans not to sell on ebay and keep this a free fansub.

But I've already gotten to a point where I pretend that we live in a perfect world (when it comes to selling fansubs).

aNToK · Post by **aNToK** » Oct 20th, '05, 21:14

Hmm... You are as forgiving as you are beautiful, Amrayu. I prefer to take a more aggressive and proactive approach, though I'm having to rely on a few 'pirates' of my own to sniff out this person. A false trail or two have delayed matters a bit, but it's just a matter of time....

amrayu · Post by **amrayu** » Oct 20th, '05, 21:27

Trust me, I was very proactive about it for awhile. Even posting up fake Ebay auctions and listing sellers IDs, and telling people that they can download it at D-addicts. I've even contacted Ebay bidders who bid on drama fansub auctions, warning them and also giving out more information.
I've also bidded on these auctions to deter people from winning. But the pirates were scared since my username was: amrayu_sarsfansubs. So, they immediately cancel my bid. ~_~

There's only so much time that I can waste to deter fansub pirating. I'd rather use that valuable time to fansub or catch up on my other hobbies.

It's a never-ending battle. Fansubs being sold for a profit is just a thorn in my side that I'm living with now. Eventually, I might get so sick of it, that I might even quit fansubbing altogether.

And who wins? Me!

mtlandis · Post by **mtlandis** » Oct 20th, '05, 21:50

Ok I tried to help out....

http://cgi.ebay.com/Asian-Dramas-with-E ... dZViewItem

Post by **mizune** » Oct 20th, '05, 21:56

I pretty much have the same view as amrayu on this.
In the end, most fansubbers are doing it because we enjoy doing it, and all we can really do is try to educate more people about it. To be honest, as long as I can release something and get feedback from ppl in this community, that's all I really care about...

And maybe it's just me and my ethical standards, but just because somebody else has broken the law, I can't justify breaking it just to get back at them. Two wrongs don't make a right... Worse yet is if you inadvertantly end up doing something that allows them to press charges on you. We can't just assume that ALL of these pirates are completely ignorant computer/security newbies or ignorant of legal matters, you know....

Mikazuki · Post by **Mikazuki** » Oct 20th, '05, 22:25

Here's my two cents on the matter... Take it with a grain of salt.

If you've contacted a person directly and they refuse to remove your work from their website the "easiest" thing to do is contact their website provider. Every website has to be hosted by some company.

www.networksolutions.com and click on whois and enter the domain name of the site. This will pull up the hosting info regardless if the person has a privacy option enabled. Most domain companies will remove a website if the site is violating their TOS. If the person is privately hosting their own website then contact their ISP and report their site as violating their TOS.

Paige · Post by **Paige** » Oct 20th, '05, 23:06

geez, $6 per DVD is a lot... is it only one or two chapters per DVD though?

My friend bought Let's Go to School, Sangdoo, Full House, My Name is Kim Sam Soon, Love Story in Harvard and Engine from a shop... each was $30-$45 in ranging in terms of price... to my horror, MNIKSS subs were taken from some forum!!! I'm not sure if it was this one, but I swear I saw it somewhere when I was downloading sample series. The subs from Sangdoo were WEIRD... like they didn't make sense at all. They were "you smelly boy" and all this weird dialogue... she was so depressed! lol. Full House and Engine were also fan subs!!! And Love Story in Harvard had the WORST grammar in the subs... geez... and she spent so much money on it!!! She let me keep the ones that had subs that made no sense since I could understand Korean and she can't... there was Mandarin audio, but she can't understand Mandarin or Canto... poor girl

I hate people who sell fansubbed series for profit... unfair to the buyer AND especially to the person who made the subs from hard work... arghhhh

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