How to Rip DVDs to Reasonable Sizes

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MasterOfPuppets
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How to Rip DVDs to Reasonable Sizes

Postby MasterOfPuppets » Tue Aug 17, 2010 2:48 am

I've been converting some of the dramas I have on VHS to DVD and I plan on subbing them, but I need help in ripping them. Right now I just rip and combine the VOBs but that comes out to about 1.2GB each episode. I'd really like to be able to make it a more reasonable 350-400MB. Thanks for any help!

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Postby XrayMind » Mon Aug 23, 2010 7:58 am

2 things, should post this in Tech Discussion as it looks like very few people this is section. I know it's somewhat related to fansub. 2nd, the crush black should be combine with message as it relate to it. I am not jump back and forth trying to answer 2 messages, if I have knowledge on the subjects.

OK, back to the subject at hand. You need give more info on the VHS source. Like what is the quality of the VHS recording? Which recording mode was the video record in? SP, LP, or EP/SLP? How long is each episodes?

What kind video capture card/device are you using? Are you converting directly to MPEG-2 or capture to RAW uncompress video format 1st and then re-encoding to MPEG2? What resolution are you using for the MPEG-2 video?

Questions for the 2nd message. Are you watching the VHS source video and the converted DVD video on the same monitor? Adjusting the black level on the analog video of VHS means nothing to most video capture card or the computer itself, it has it own black level. Remember VHS's video black level came from broadcast video. Video on computer did follow broadcast video until recently and only with switch to digital video.

Anyway, convert analog video(VHS) to digital video(MPEG-2) has always had issues. My prefect solution, A Super-VHS video with S-video output, yes it can play standard VHS tape. A capture card/device that has S-Video input and you let you capture RAW uncompressed AVI container. So older will save in MJPEG, motion JPEG, but it's still compress. Hard drives are cheap now. If you planing to ARCHIVE your video, you can clean up video up using AviSynth and the available filters, noise, black level, color correction, and etc. VHS resolution is only 350×480 for NTSC and DVD NTSC spec support a 352x480 resolution, so that the video resolution you are going to compress in. Now I don't know what data rate will the MPEG-2 compression will be, you might drop filesize in half, since the resolution is half the full 720x480. So the filesize might be 600M. You are not going any better compression. That's why we moved on to MPEG-4 ASP(xvid) and AVC(x264) for better compression on data rate and quality.
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MasterOfPuppets
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Postby MasterOfPuppets » Mon Aug 23, 2010 3:54 pm

XrayMind wrote:OK, back to the subject at hand. You need give more info on the VHS source. Like what is the quality of the VHS recording? Which recording mode was the video record in? SP, LP, or EP/SLP? How long is each episodes?


Factory recorded SP, ~45 minutes.

XrayMind wrote:What kind video capture card/device are you using? Are you converting directly to MPEG-2 or capture to RAW uncompress video format 1st and then re-encoding to MPEG2? What resolution are you using for the MPEG-2 video?


I was converting to MPEG 2 with my external capture card. I now also have a DVD recorder.

XrayMind wrote:Questions for the 2nd message. Are you watching the VHS source video and the converted DVD video on the same monitor? Adjusting the black level on the analog video of VHS means nothing to most video capture card or the computer itself, it has it own black level. Remember VHS's video black level came from broadcast video. Video on computer did follow broadcast video until recently and only with switch to digital video.


Yes I am. Is there no way to properly convert NTSC-J to NTSC-U then?

XrayMind wrote:Anyway, convert analog video(VHS) to digital video(MPEG-2) has always had issues. My prefect solution, A Super-VHS video with S-video output, yes it can play standard VHS tape. A capture card/device that has S-Video input and you let you capture RAW uncompressed AVI container. So older will save in MJPEG, motion JPEG, but it's still compress. Hard drives are cheap now. If you planing to ARCHIVE your video, you can clean up video up using AviSynth and the available filters, noise, black level, color correction, and etc. VHS resolution is only 350×480 for NTSC and DVD NTSC spec support a 352x480 resolution, so that the video resolution you are going to compress in. Now I don't know what data rate will the MPEG-2 compression will be, you might drop filesize in half, since the resolution is half the full 720x480. So the filesize might be 600M. You are not going any better compression. That's why we moved on to MPEG-4 ASP(xvid) and AVC(x264) for better compression on data rate and quality.


Alright, I'll have to check Avisynth out. Thanks!

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Postby XrayMind » Tue Aug 24, 2010 4:40 am

MasterOfPuppets wrote:Yes I am. Is there no way to properly convert NTSC-J to NTSC-U then?


Oh yea I forgot to mention that NTSC-J black level and NTSC-U black level are different. So when you output NTSC-J video on NTSC-U monitor, it looks darker than on NTSC-J monitor. Anyway, both NTSC-J and PAL set black at 0 IRE, while NTSC-U is set at 7.5 IRE.

In AVIsynth, you use the 'Level' and 'Histogram' script command to adjust the black level for your video as explain in this discussion thread. If AVIsynth is too complicated for you, there is also way to adjust in VirtualDub, since this is GUI program and unlike AVIsynth, a scripted frame server emulator for AVI file. Here is that discussion thread.
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Postby bloggingpig » Tue Aug 24, 2010 5:48 am

1) Once you've got it into a DVD, you can easily rip it using simple-to-use programs like Nero Recode to get it into standard MP4/H.264 format (likely going to stick around forever and ever given it's ISO standardization). You can also use many other programs (eg. DVDFab, Slysoft CloneDVD Mobile, etc - many listed in videohelp.com ->TOOLS) to rip & convert in one step as well.

Naturally, 2-pass is the best along with maximum quality settings if you don't mind the wait.

2) Different codecs will provide different efficiencies at compression.
Thus, MJPEG files > MPEG-2 files > MPEG-4/MP4 files > H.264 MPEG-4 files in size for the same quality.
In the old days, many encoded to Divx/Xvid (MPEG-4 ish) but since H.264 MPEG-4 files are supported on almost everything nowadays, this can be the better format since you get better looking video in a smaller file.

3) Run a few tests yourself at various bitrates (thus you'll know how big each file is) to see what effects smaller file sizes will do to your video.

THIS IS THE KEY prior to doing a big batch job!

Some people like me are picky picky, so I'll bump up the bitrate until the source and original look the same. Others aren't and will use lower bitrates and give it a blind eye.

Also, maintaining the original video size (720x480 or whatever you've got on the DVD) is key to maintaining the original picture quality. Smaller sizes result in smaller file sizes, but it won't have as much detail.

4) Pre-adjusting levels may not matter depending on your encoder. Some allow you to set the IRE level of the incoming video (0 or 7.5), so even if you just to a straight rip from the DVD, it'll convert fine in the end.

5) Any sort of compression will take time and energy to process vs. a straight MPEG-2 rip from the DVD. 2TB HDs are only $110 or so, so keep that in mind.
4.3GB per disk for 45 min, about 450+ episodes.
Buy 2 HDs as backup to each other, and it's only $220 spent.

(On the flip side, encode to H.264, and you can likely put ~3 on a DVD. Look at the scene rips such as http://www.h33t.com/details.php?id=8250d41cffb8b295339fa9fda5d2bacad38c16eb and you see that ~1.4GB is about as low as they go before quality starts to go south converting from MPEG-2 DVDs.)

That's about 2800+ episodes on a 2TB drive in H.264 at 700MB per 45min episode (1.4GB for a typical 90 minute movie divided by 2).

6) SuperVHS to DVD or a VHS+DVD deck is the way to go w/o going to pro decks. Usually, the best possible for a consumer converting things short of a Canopus ADVC-100 box + SuperVHS deck. (the latter lets you record directly to DV files on the PC, thus, bypassing the more significant MPEG-2 compression image quality loss you get going from VHS to DVD. DV is still a compressed format, but it's far less lossy than MPEG-2 for sure.)

Have fun! Try H.264! and Luck!


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