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| Should a site similiar to D-Addicts be created for Japanese Movies? |
| Yes |
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85% |
[ 131 ] |
| No |
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14% |
[ 23 ] |
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| Total Votes : 154 |
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| Author |
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ad Joined: 10 Mar 2004 Total posts: 89 Location: LA Gender: Male |
 Posted: Sun May 30, 2004 11:54 am Post subject: Post Rating: 0 |
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jholic:
all this is turning into a flame war and i'd rather avoid it.
i think you are confusing with a teen who likes to get freebies off the Internet and uses any reasonable and unreasonable arguments to justify his behavior. I'm not into modern pop culture, i don't download gigs of new mp3 or dvd-rips of Hollywood movies. I’ve been using this site to download jdramas as I’m learning Japanese. I would just rent them if they were available at the Bloockbuster one block away form my place. I guess I could probably rent them somewhere in downtown LA but I’m too lazy to drive there/pay for the parking etc. I’m not even interested much in j-movies ‘cos most of them suck.
So out of the list of options you presented I’d pick
"hey, it's free and easy.", definitely easier than to drive to downtown LA.
I was not trying to justify my behavior but to make some observations and draw conclusions from them. As I see from your previous post some of my ideas got misrepresented and distorted. I only blame myself for not being clear. I do not intend to go through our posts line by line and put more gas into the flame. I am just going to reiterate my arguments in a brief and hopefully clear way and end our discussion. You can PM me if you have any questions.
In your previous posts you posed a lot of questions:
| Quote: |
“great news is that its the number one most downloaded thing on the net!
do you feel your views about d/ling would change? do you feel other d/lers, placed in that situation, would feel the same as you?”
“do you think there would be a loss of jobs?”
“do you feel that the benefit gained by so many (at the expense of Z) was ok? what if Z was a close friend of yours?”
“if your "dl anything off the internet legally" world ever came true, we'd all be watching LOTR with midgets and a C budget.”
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I can summarize them as “how would you like the brand new world with widespread filesharing?” I am not going to answer this question. My posts were NOT about FEELINGS, they were about my vision of the future. As a scientist I don’t let my feelings interfere with my analysis and conclusions. I may not like the future I see as well, but I’m not going to b*tch about it.
As you mentioned you preferred BT-sl*t arguments. I can see why. Both of you stayed within the legal framework. (I actually found some his arguments weak but I’m not going to be anal about it here.) My arguments, on the other hand, are purely philosophical, they are not about the law, they are above the law.
Ok, now to the point. What I wanted to say was
1. Many people perceive it to be normal to share stuff on the Internet.
Sharing existed before the advent of the hi-speed Internet. We all copied CDs we borrowed from friends but the Internet has dramatically amplified that behavior. Everybody knows that copying CDs is illegal but people still think it’s normal.
Yes, there’re laws against piracy but they were created to fight those who actually sell somebody else’s work for profit.
As I said people’s behavior is determined by what they think is right and wrong, not by the laws. Most people don’t even know the laws. Have you read all the laws pass by the Congress? Have you read any? Just one?
(You suggested that if not the laws people would kill each other in the streets. This is a very wrong statement. First, the laws don’t seem to stop people from killing each other now. And the murder statistics doesn’t seem to correlate with the strictness of the punishment. However, the issue of homicide is too complex to discuss it here. I will refer you to zoopsychology textbooks and give you a hint here: animals (except for monkeys and rats) don’t kill each other although they don’t have any laws).
A good example of what happens when people think that the law is unjust is the “Boston Tea Party”. Was it against the law? Yes. Did it hurt somebody? Of course. But now people think it was so cool that they even dedicated a museum to that event.
http://www.bostonteapartyship.com/
http://campus.northpark.edu/history/WebChron/USA/TeaParty.html
And again I don’t claim that the majority of the population shares stuff on the internet. I just claim that the majority doesn’t think it’s wrong.
2. Obviously, this trend is going to monetarily hurt the recording, movie and software industries if the stick to their current business models. And of course, that will hurt the employees too.
Similar precedents happened in human history many times. For example, introduction of machines in the textile industry in the early 19th century, caused temporary unemployment and created the infamous the luddite movement. You’d probably ask me: “How would you feel if it was your farther/brother/cousin who lost his job?”. I’d say:”It’d suck”. But let me ask you: “ Do you really want to go back to manual manufacturing?” Or maybe we should just get rid of the Internet.
I think the entertainment industry will be shifting towards computer games in the future. The revenues of the movie industry have been steadily going down recently. I think the computer game industry has already surpassed the movie industry in terms of revenue. You can’t pirate online computer games, so perhaps that is the next big thing.
3. Many people believe that the author’s right to control the distribution of his/her work is something natural, God-given. Personally, I don’t have any problem with that. But I clearly see that with the advent of the Internet nobody can control the distribution of information in digital form. Basically the copyright law becomes unenforceable in that area. Surely RIAA is trying to scare the sh*t out of people but it’s still a drop in bucket.
So my conclusions are
-The copyright laws are irrelevant. Because first,it’s impossible to catch all “violators” and impossible to prosecute them (not enough judges, courtrooms and prisons);second, if they really try to enforce people will revolt. Those people who share stuff on the internet also have a right to vote.
-the entertainment industry will have to change to survive.
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lordruinJoined: 05 May 2004 Total posts: 16 Location: england Gender: Unknown |
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lordruinJoined: 05 May 2004 Total posts: 16 Location: england Gender: Unknown |
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jholicJoined: 03 Feb 2004 Total posts: 6273 Location: missin' hawaii Gender: Male |
| Posted: Thu Jun 03, 2004 5:37 am Post subject: Post Rating: 0 |
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ad: thanks for the post. i thought your ideas and perspective was represented much better than your previous posts. i don't agree with all of it, but what i find ironic is that you and i probably agree on more issues than we originally thought.
| ad wrote: | Everybody knows that copying CDs is illegal but people still think it’s normal.
And again I don’t claim that the majority of the population shares stuff on the internet. I just claim that the majority doesn’t think it’s wrong. |
contradictory. but it sums up what i have been saying all along. we know this is wrong, but we do it anyways. the TRUE reason this is being done is because this ALTERNATIVE is available to us, and there is still a relatively LOW RISK OF GETTING CAUGHT.
also, i disagree that the MAJORITY of the population believes that filesharing isn't wrong (especially if they understand what it is). however, i will give you this. a large part of the population may not care, may agree that our actions were brought upon by insane prices, OR may want to join us if they knew how. i don't know about the MAJORITY (150 Million) - but perhaps a considerable amount.
| ad wrote: | | 2. Obviously, this trend is going to monetarily hurt the recording, movie and software industries if the stick to their current business models. And of course, that will hurt the employees too. |
your previous posts did not seem to reflect this, but i agree with you. i also agree with your examples, and i want to point out some of my own. back when audio tapes and vhs tapes were more proliferant, there were illegal copies being made as well. as you pointed out, the laws were existent, but not madly enforced. also, copies of audio/vhs tapes were pretty crappy - and you stood to ruin the original.
with the advent of the internet and broadband, why has this suddenly changed? do i really need to answer this question for you? many teens seem to have more pirated things than legal ones. although p2p and filesharing has been around for many years, broadband has made it much more popular. and the RIAA/MPAA has started to crack down.
| ad wrote: | Basically the copyright law becomes unenforceable in that area. Surely RIAA is trying to scare the sh*t out of people but it’s still a drop in bucket.
So my conclusions are
-The copyright laws are irrelevant. Because first,it’s impossible to catch all “violators” and impossible to prosecute them (not enough judges, courtrooms and prisons);second, if they really try to enforce people will revolt. Those people who share stuff on the internet also have a right to vote.
-the entertainment industry will have to change to survive. |
trust me, the laws are quite enforceable there. it would be silly for me to compare how many cases the RIAA/MPAA has won vs how many they have lost.
agreed. it will be difficult to catch all violators, but do you think that the more p2p becomes proliferant, the less they'll try to stop it?!? you should also realize that many of these cases have been settled out of court w/o judges, etc. many of them have simply paid the fines - because, as i reiterate, they knew they were wrong, and this time they got caught.
also agreed. the entertainment industry will have to change, but it may not be the kind of change us p2p users will like. i see this transforming into a cat and mouse game, kind of like virus vs antivirus, hackers vs security, etc. and just like those people, it will always be illegal. the more proliferant p2p becomes, the harder the RIAA/MPAA will fight. it will just be a question of how many people get caught. and whether the people left will want to continue doing it.
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dofuagedashiLocation: The Big Apple Age: 31 Gender: Male |
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HocineJoined: 11 Oct 2004 Total posts: 21 Gender: Unknown |
| Posted: Wed Oct 13, 2004 2:45 pm Post subject: Post Rating: 0 |
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| So what's the status of this?
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geoffropuffJoined: 10 Dec 2003 Total posts: 389 Gender: Unknown |
| Posted: Wed Oct 13, 2004 3:02 pm Post subject: Post Rating: 0 |
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| all of the movie torrents that used to be here were moved to fantastic super club.
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hegoraJoined: 28 Mar 2004 Total posts: 22 Location: quebec, canada Age: 29 Gender: Female |
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RuroshinJoined: 05 Dec 2003 Total posts: 2748 Gender: Male |
| Posted: Tue Oct 19, 2004 10:48 pm Post subject: Post Rating: 0 |
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This topic still alive? There will be no j-addicts at least not run by me.
locking.
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