http://d-addicts.com
 
Register
 
HOME TORRENT DRAMA WIKI STATS HELP (FAQ) SEARCH GROUPS PROFILE PRIVATE MESSAGES LOGIN
      

Querbeet

Goto page 1, 2, 3  Next
 
Reply to topic    D-Addicts Forum Index -> Fansubbing
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Querbeet
Avatar

Gender: Unknown
PostPosted: Tue Aug 11, 2009 11:39 am    Post subject: Querbeet   Post Rating: 0 Reply with quote



[Announcements & News]


----------------------

Current Discussion
Embedded Multilingual Subtitles

----------------------



Post your feedback, suggestions, comments on the subtitles here. Help us improve our subtitles.
Do not ask or request subtitles here. Thank you!

No flaming, no bashing, absolutely no spamming! Be respectful, and keep the thread clean!

_________________
HELP US COMPLETE OTOMEN
WikiLJForums


Last edited by Querbeet on Wed Aug 12, 2009 5:52 am; edited 1 time in total


Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website 
eyeOffline
Joined: 02 May 2006
Total posts: 117
PostPosted: Wed Aug 12, 2009 4:59 am    Post subject:    Post Rating: 0 Reply with quote

Here's a topic that we discussed internally for a while. We would like to know your opinion about it.

Embedded Multilingual Subtitles

Those of you who downloaded any of our 2009 releases probably noticed that we switched away from AVI in favor of MKV. This has brought about a number of benefits: much smaller files (and therefore faster downloads), full DVD resolution (480p anamorphic widescreen instead of the smaller 704x396), compatibility with upcoming DivX Plus hardware, and the option to embed softsubs (both SRT and ASS) with the video.

Now the question is: Would you prefer embedded softsubs instead of hardsubs? Here are some pros and cons of embedded softsubs:

Pros:
- font family, size and color can be changed according to your preferences
- sharper edges
- multiple languages in one video file
- can be turned off

Cons:
- not as fancy as hardsubs (most hardware players will only display SRT)
- karaoke must still be hardsubbed

Your opinions matter, so let us know what you think!

_________________
Back to top
View user's profile 
AriBauerOffline
Avatar

Joined: 31 Jul 2007
Total posts: 41
Location: Canada
Age: 22
Gender: Male
PostPosted: Wed Aug 12, 2009 5:28 am    Post subject:    Post Rating: 0 Reply with quote

I've always been a proponent of softsubs (SRT). I think it's one of the most flexible and compatible formats available. It works for almost all players and consoles. It's probably the more convenient format, and not likely to give much people hassle, or troubles.

Personally, I never really cared for fancy coloring and styles. As long as I'm able to see, read, and understand the text, that is all that matters.

It's awesome that you want our opinions. Thanks to everyone at Querbeet for all your efforts and hard work you put into your subbing! Gambatte!


Last edited by AriBauer on Wed Aug 12, 2009 5:29 am; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website 
lullabyeOffline
Joined: 02 May 2009
Total posts: 78
Gender: Unknown
PostPosted: Wed Aug 12, 2009 5:29 am    Post subject:    Post Rating: 0 Reply with quote

I love softsubs. It's great to be able to adjust the subs to whatever screen I am using. What looks good on my laptop doesn't look so great on the TV.
Back to top
View user's profile 
nell123Offline
Avatar

Joined: 17 Sep 2007
Total posts: 50
Age: 26
Gender: Female
PostPosted: Wed Aug 12, 2009 5:56 am    Post subject:    Post Rating: 0 Reply with quote

Softsubs. I don’t really care about fancy looking subtitles. I like being able to adjust things according to my preference.

Embedded subs only is ok with me. As long as I can turn them on and of and change font size I'm happy. Smile




P.S. Thank you guys for subbing all these wonderful dramas.


Last edited by nell123 on Wed Aug 12, 2009 1:34 pm; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile 
k361Offline
Joined: 29 Jan 2009
Total posts: 163
PostPosted: Wed Aug 12, 2009 12:47 pm    Post subject:    Post Rating: 0 Reply with quote

I can live with HS and SS.

Only got problems with .ssa or .ass and vlc. My player didnt show this subs on paused movie.
Some Subbers use to small fonts for the hardsub.

I watch an computer and can handle all formats and love the new mkv (480p) from Querbeet.

I like the idea of the embedded subs.
This subs can turned off. No need for new RAWs, if i find a srt in my language (german).

Will Querbeet switch to multilanguage subs with embedded mkv format?
Back to top
View user's profile 
qnhu
Avatar

Fansubber
PostPosted: Wed Aug 12, 2009 1:00 pm    Post subject:    Post Rating: 0 Reply with quote

k361 wrote:
Will Querbeet switch to multilanguage subs with embedded mkv format?

We will provide both embedded English and German .srt files, most likely. Might take a day or two longer but we'll have both subs.

Btw, guys, please do not only voice your opinions on softsubs or hardsubs, but also if you would be okay if we did embedded subs ONLY. Thank you (:

_________________
TYPESETTER AND ENCODER NEEDED FOR OTOMEN
SUPPORT FANSUBBERS BY DOWNLOADING - DO NOT WATCH YOUR DRAMAS ON STREAMING SITES!
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website 
mikkichanOffline
Avatar

Joined: 01 Dec 2005
Total posts: 256
Gender: Unknown
PostPosted: Wed Aug 12, 2009 1:37 pm    Post subject:    Post Rating: 0 Reply with quote

eye wrote:


Now the question is: Would you prefer embedded softsubs instead of hardsubs? Here are some pros and cons of embedded softsubs:

Pros:
- font family, size and color can be changed according to your preferences
- sharper edges
- multiple languages in one video file
- can be turned off

Cons:
- not as fancy as hardsubs (most hardware players will only display SRT)
- karaoke must still be hardsubbed

Your opinions matter, so let us know what you think!


Here's my opinion:

I care about the color and style of my sub...maybe I'm just picky like that Tongue so I preferred hardsub. One of the joy of watching hardsub is to see what the typesetters come up with for the color and the font, which always amaze me and they always did such an amazing job. I've never encounter any problem with subtitle being too big or too small at all (at least from Querbeet), either on my Macbook, PC or plasma TV so I'm not sure what everyone was talking about.

I'm sure embedded softsub will be more versatile since user can change the font size, color etc but aren't they already doing that with softsub? so there's no point to embedded the softsub then. Plus those who already preferred softsub doesn't have to download their RAW file twice. Another thing to consider is the player itself, which player will allow users to do that function? on a MAC and/or a PC?

So yeah personally I preferred softsub and hardsub to be separate, instead of embedded softsub to become hardsub scratch if you got what I mean.
Back to top
View user's profile 
isabelh2o2Offline
Joined: 11 Jul 2009
Total posts: 19
Gender: Unknown
PostPosted: Wed Aug 12, 2009 2:02 pm    Post subject:    Post Rating: 0 Reply with quote

I hope you will continue to provide either soft subs or hard subbed rather than embedded subs only. I have not been able to make the embedded subs work (I tried to follow the steps listed by Rollins when he started doing embedded subs). For those, I decided to wait until the subbing was over, and the soft subs released. But if you do go to embedded subs only, I will make a greater effort, because I really like your subbing work. Thanks for all the shows you have done so far!
Back to top
View user's profile 
Drazic
Avatar

Location: Netherlands
Age: 19
Gender: Male
PostPosted: Wed Aug 12, 2009 2:54 pm    Post subject:    Post Rating: 0 Reply with quote

If you're going to go with mkv then imo embedded softsubs is the obvious choice. It's better looking, has more options and anything that can play mkv should be able to do embedded softsubs. Especially for a group like querbeet who wants to do german subs too it can be very usefull to be able to have 2 subtitle tracks.

Your cons are bit odd as i havent heard of a hardware player that does mkv but not .ass subs, are there any? And there's nothing wrong with hardsubbing the karaoke, a lot of groups do that. (well, anime groups =P)

Just make sure you get rid of your watermark. I dont want to download the mkv just to de-mux the subs ;)


mikkichan wrote:


Here's my opinion:

I care about the color and style of my sub...maybe I'm just picky like that Tongue so I preferred hardsub. One of the joy of watching hardsub is to see what the typesetters come up with for the color and the font, which always amaze me and they always did such an amazing job. I've never encounter any problem with subtitle being too big or too small at all (at least from Querbeet), either on my Macbook, PC or plasma TV so I'm not sure what everyone was talking about.
.


Any typesetting querbeet does now with their hardsubs will work and look exactly the same in embedded softsubs =) Even better actually /o/

mikkichan wrote:

Another thing to consider is the player itself, which player will allow users to do that function? on a MAC and/or a PC?
.

Since i'm assuming you're running OS X, you can use either Quicktime with Perian, Mplayer extended or VLC =)

_________________


Last edited by Drazic on Wed Aug 12, 2009 5:40 pm; edited 2 times in total
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website 
Querbeet
Avatar

Gender: Unknown
PostPosted: Wed Aug 12, 2009 4:14 pm    Post subject:    Post Rating: 0 Reply with quote

Drazic wrote:
i know this is spam so if any of the querbeet staff wants this gone, let me know and i'll remove it from my post)

If you know it's spam, why are you even posting it then? People know that embedded subs are used by several groups, not only HaroRangers. So if you would remove the link please; we'd really appreciate it. This is a feedback and discussion thread, not a platform to advertise.
Still, thanks for the input. Smile

_________________
HELP US COMPLETE OTOMEN
WikiLJForums
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website 
hafizadamOffline
Avatar

Joined: 29 Mar 2007
Total posts: 185
Location: Cairo, Egypt
Age: 20
Gender: Male
PostPosted: Wed Aug 12, 2009 5:07 pm    Post subject:    Post Rating: 0 Reply with quote

one more pros I think eye forgot to include:

As you all know, our files are smaller than RAW, and we believe the quality is on par with the RAW (or even better =P) so with embedded subs, you can turn off the subtitle, and watch them like watching RAW, with smaller size.

So our target will be both who need the subtitle, and those who dont.

The only drawback is you need to wait a little longer. I think it still worth it. The discussion thread will be less spoiler because everybody will watch at the same time, pinch
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website 
Drazic
Avatar

Location: Netherlands
Age: 19
Gender: Male
PostPosted: Wed Aug 12, 2009 5:35 pm    Post subject:    Post Rating: 0 Reply with quote

Querbeet wrote:
Drazic wrote:
i know this is spam so if any of the querbeet staff wants this gone, let me know and i'll remove it from my post)

If you know it's spam, why are you even posting it then? People know that embedded subs are used by several groups, not only HaroRangers. So if you would remove the link please; we'd really appreciate it. This is a feedback and discussion thread, not a platform to advertise.
Still, thanks for the input. Smile

True, so i removed it like i promised ^^. Just wanted to give a example of mkv+embedded subs but since I did realise it kind of was spam i added that in case you guys didnt like it.

_________________
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website 
eyeOffline
Joined: 02 May 2006
Total posts: 117
PostPosted: Wed Aug 12, 2009 8:13 pm    Post subject:    Post Rating: 0 Reply with quote

isabelh2o2 wrote:
I have not been able to make the embedded subs work (I tried to follow the steps listed by Rollins when he started doing embedded subs).

If we decide to embed softsubs, we will prepare the videos so that the subs show up automatically. It didn't work in Rollins' case because he was using MP4 instead of MKV.

Drazic wrote:
Your cons are bit odd as i havent heard of a hardware player that does mkv but not .ass subs, are there any?

Yes, Western Digital's WDTV, for example. For DivX Plus certified devices, only SRT support is mandatory. Even if a device supports ASS, most of the styling information will probably be stripped away, and I don't expect support for embedded TrueType fonts any time soon.

ASS is a very complex format without a reliable reference implementation. The existing renderers (VSFilter and libASS) sometimes produce very different results.

For these reasons we will have to embed SRT as a fallback option anyway. And if we embed ASS, don't expect the full range of fonts and effects we put into our hardsubs.

Quote:
Just make sure you get rid of your watermark. I dont want to download the mkv just to de-mux the subs ;)

Hardsubbed credits and watermarks are not going away. If you can't live with them, the RAW remains your only option. Sorry. Tongue

_________________
Back to top
View user's profile 
Drazic
Avatar

Location: Netherlands
Age: 19
Gender: Male
PostPosted: Wed Aug 12, 2009 8:38 pm    Post subject:    Post Rating: 0 Reply with quote

eye wrote:
.
Yes, Western Digital's WDTV, for example. For DivX Plus certified devices, only SRT support is mandatory. Even if a device supports ASS, most of the styling information will probably be stripped away, and I don't expect support for embedded TrueType fonts any time soon.

ASS is a very complex format without a reliable reference implementation. The existing renderers (VSFilter and libASS) sometimes produce very different results.

For these reasons we will have to embed SRT as a fallback option anyway. And if we embed ASS, don't expect the full range of fonts and effects we put into our hardsubs.



I see, i dont have one of them so i always assumed they properly supported .ass xD That's still no reason to not make the .ass embedded subs the same as your hardsubs though? Havent seen those in a while though so i have no idea what the "Full range of fonts and effects" are =P.

eye wrote:
.

Hardsubbed credits and watermarks are not going away. If you can't live with them, the RAW remains your only option. Sorry. Tongue


Too bad, this all is useless for me unless you stop using your watermark. I'll always chose the softsubs/someone else his subs over a watermarked vid. Even if that means i'd have to download the vid twice >_> (that would be very lame lol).

Still doing a watermark with mkv+embedded subs kind of fails imo (always fails but fails even more when used together with mkv+embedded softsubs xD). But i dont really care about the filesize anyway so i'll just keep getting the raws then =)

_________________
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website 
Display posts from previous:   
Reply to topic    D-Addicts Forum Index -> Fansubbing All times are GMT - 1 Hours
Goto page 1, 2, 3  Next
Page 1 of 3
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum